The Scottish Government

If the major parties show reluctance to support a referundum for Scottish independence, perhaps support should be canvassed for a vote in England to expel Scotland from the Union? I'd vote for it, and I suspect many of my countrymen would agree. Discuss.

First I would say Alex Salmond has shown mature statesmanship as First Minister and I would urge him not to "devolve" into petty party politics; I believe the whole British Nation is sick and tired of party wrangling and blame-mongering.

1). I think the SNP should de-emphasise its policy on nuclear power. It probably loses more supporters than it encourages. We don't want brownouts in our independent economy while alternative power sources slowly grow.

2). Similarly for nuvlear weapons; I suspect if it weren't for the "nuclear detergent", I'd have been called up many years ago and thrown in as fodder to the front line in Western Europe, given a gun and a tin hat, and told to try and hold a line to give the regular army 24 hours to arrive and dig in.

3). Europe. Many don't like the EU, with its layers of unapproachable bureaucracy and unworkable rules; also the total loss of national sovereignty that has already occurred while Westminster wrangels internally both inter and intra party. Suggest that EU membership is not automatic if we get independence. Perhaps a possibilty along the lines of Switzerland is an alternative, with its ready access to trade within the EU but without having to bend the knee to Brussels Directives formulated by a handful of self-serving plc board members.

4). Since independence is becoming nearly inevitable, great care should be taken to keep English goodwill. England is our nearest trading neighbour and probably still accounts for 56% of our tourists. Perhaps the SNP could consider supporting the stance that Scottish MPs should not vote on purely English issues.

There are huge opportunities for Scotland as the newest nation, in terms of tourism from the US, Canada, Australia and New Zealand - and all over. Such tourism and other means could encourage huge business opportunities to Scotland. Perhaps tax could be cut greatly with increased GDP (or whatever), giving even more incentives for global companies to have their HQs in Scotland. Not to forget the revenue from our stamps and other collectables!

Oh, one more thing, it's not too early to consider our ccTLD (country code top level domain) for the internet - I suggest .ab (see http://www.acctld.co.uk). To get this we'd have to get an ISO 3166-1 two-letter code for reasons other than to get a ccTLD, so research into this should be well in hand already ...

... it won't be long now!

Please- Enough already!! Only 31% of Scots want independence. Majority rules. 69% want to remain as we are. Why the debate???
By the way, we will fight(by whatever means) to remain in the Union.
Rule Britannia- God save the Queen!

Hi Gavin

I must say that I was quite taken aback but your likening of me to a Nazi. I think every other person who has used this message board will agree with me when I say that at no point have I spouted any extremist view. Just because I have pro-British views does not in anyway make me a 'mini’ Hitler.

So let’s get one thing clear. Being a unionist does not make you racist or xenophobic. I have no problems with Britain being in the EU (although I oppose full integration) and I find European people to be very kind and warm people. You should also note that at no point did I say Scottish people were xenophobic. Euro Scepticism does not equal racism and intolerance. So when you start to make the above accusations all you are doing is undermining your own argument.

Can I ask what ever happened to the days when you would say there is room for ‘friendly banter’?

I see that you are still unable to get your head around the fact that I am both a proud Scot and a proud Briton. According to you cannot truly be Scottish unless you marry yourself to everything Scottish. Having a passion for Britain means, in your book at least, that I am a diluted Scot and therefore I am the hybrid weirdo that I spoke of in a previous thread.

So what of all those famous Scots who supported unionist parties in the run up to the Holyrood election? People like Alex McLeish who publicly backed the union? Are you more Scottish than the most popular man in the country just now?

And please can we drop the whole Scotland would still be British if independent thing. We would not be British, we would have a British past, that’s it. According to your thread Belgium is a wee bit French because both countries share a common language. I don’t think many Belgians would subscribe to such a view but there you go!

You also say that people are ‘politically shoehorned’ into being British. If that were true then where do nationalist views come from? Such a statement doesn’t even stand up to historical scrutiny. Even in the days when ‘Britishness’ was stronger a strong sense of ‘Scottishness’ always existed.

You ask if I would support a referendum. Well to be honest I think the SNP ‘government’ should spend its time doing what it was elected to do, that is govern Scotland on devolved matters. After all it’s not the public that are calling for a referendum it’s the SNP. Nonetheless, if one is called, and the unionist parties put forward a positive case for the union then why not. At present the SNP would not win and by their own admission they would have to shelve future plans if defeated.

In today’s ever smaller world, of globalisation and the like, it makes no sense for the countries which make up the British Isles to go their separate ways. We have a proud history, we have shared customs and common values why waste that?

202. Sean Dady - London
Sunday, October 28, 2007 23:47

Expell?

The Union of the United Kingdom is between Scotland and England(incorporating the Welsh and N.Irish).

Like in a marriage it may comfort you to think in terms of expelling your spouse from that marriage, but to expell one you in effect expell both.

Without Scotland there is no UK.

I think a term you might be looking for is 'dissolve', as in dissolve the Threaty of Union 1707.
Yes I'd vote for that.

203. Dave Eastabrook - Largs, Ayrshire
Monday, October 29, 2007 02:22
1)Nuclear power is being punted as green and low carbon but it will leave a legacy of highly toxic nuclear waste for generations to pay to keep safe.

Face it the reason that Labour has changed its position on nuclear is because it wants to upgrade our WMD delivery capability and return to the good old days of the Cold War.
At least back then you knew where to find the baddies.

Weapons grade nuclear material comes from....nuclear power stations, ask any Iranian.



2) Dump the nukes. That might not play well in the Home Counties but in Scotland there's not many would argue against removing the nuclear bullseye from the Clyde.

Who do they deter?
Ask the Iraqis. They had nukes and chemical/biological WMDs ready for launch within 45minutes, according to Honest Tony.
Wasn't that the reason we attacked Iraq?

3) You're starting to gibber.

4)Retain the Union, for the sake of English tourists?
Is the reason we have so many English tourists not got more to do with travelling distances and family ties rather than the complexion of the government?
How often do you check up on the state of the local parties before heading off to the Costa del Sunshine?

Perhaps you might also consider that I'm pretty certain it has been SNP policy for many years now not to vote on purely English matters at Westminster. Shockeroony

Newest nation?
As I understand it Scotland never stopped being a nation and, I stand to be corrected, Scotland is one of the, if not actually the oldest, modern western nation.

As a visiting American associate commented when I explained some of the history of Edinburgh Castle, Mary's Chapel in particular:
'Sh!t, back home we don't even have dirt that old!'

All this debate does is polarise opinions, Do you want your own Armed forces ? I for one think Mr Salmon is doing his best to wind up Westminster - free prescriptions etc. If you Scots think life will be better without the union - I say go for it. Guarantee ours will.

203. Dave Eastabrook - Largs, Ayrshire

Dave,

I have to disagree with you on your first point, most people I know are against nuclear power stations.

Your second point is a tad weird to say the least , this is 2007 not 1914, what western front are you talking about??

--

Craig 205, take a look at the clown in the previous post 204, and yes your unionist rants are rather nazi like, no?

What a mature, intelligent idea, asking the Scottish people their opinion on their own destiny.

I've not doubt that us Scots must 'play it long.' I find most of my friends' fear of independence tiresome, depressing and showing a complete lack of ambition.

I believe that our Scottish Gov. is going about things the right way. Show it can govern competently, win votes through popular policies which bring about tangible change in the lives of Scots.

Show it can be trusted, minimise the dreadful 'tit for tat' Holyrood slanging matches of old by never rising to Labour's bait. Be business-like.

In a word, govern quietly and effectively, building up trust, showing how independence will greatly improve quality of life by making the population BELIEVE IN ITSELF.

The question is, how do you do that, without terrifying them?

One answer may be to govern well in the first term and don't bang on about independence too much during this time, while making critical statistics available to the press at regular intervals. Clever TV/Press campaigns
MUST be used.

Talking to my friends, they want policies which will improve their lives, from day to day. Period.

Scrapping prescription charges, free school meals, making the M8 all-motorway are superb moves, as is banning the building of nuclear power stations, keeping A&E units open and scrapping bridge tolls.

How do we leave this suffocating, unequal Union? In a phrase,

'Softly, Softly Catchy Monkey.'

Best,



Stuart Rivans.

i am an english person and the idea of an independant scotland is pure stupidity. for a start Shetland is the richest in oil money and if scotland did go independant then Westminister would stop giving scotland money and then SNP would dry shetland dry from its money
SO I SAY DOWN WITH SCOTLAND
who agrees with me?