Minutes of the 6th Meeting of the Freshwater Fisheries
Forum Steering Group held at, Strathearn House, Broxden,
Perth, on Monday 17 January 2005.
In attendance:
David Dunkley - SEERAD (Chairman)
Manson Wright - SEERAD
Shauna Cranney- SEERAD (Secretariat)
Andrew Wallace - Association of Salmon Fishery
Boards
Brian Davidson - Association of Salmon Fishery
Boards
George Holdsworth - Association of Scottish Stillwater
Fisheries
Seymour Monro - Atlantic Salmon Trust
Jane Davis - British Trout Association
Willie Miller - Consultative Committee on Protection
Orders
Professor Peter Maitland - Fish Conservation Centre
Ross Gardiner- Fisheries Research Services
Dr Alastair Stephen - Institute of Fisheries
Management
Roger Brook - Rivers and Fisheries Trusts of
Scotland
Ronnie Picken - Scottish Anglers National
Association
Derek Keith - Scottish Campaign for Public Angling
Ron Woods - Scottish Federation for Coarse Angling
David Howell - Scottish Natural Heritage
Miranda Lindsay- Scottish Rural Property and Business
Association
Craig Campbell - National Farmers Union (Scotland)
Introduction
1. David Dunkley offered apologies on behalf of Gordon
Brown who could not attend the meeting due to illness and
informed the meeting that he would be standing in as
Chairman for this meeting. He also informed the meeting
that Roger Brook would be the new representative from
RAFTS.
Apologies
2. Apologies were received from Callum Sinclair (SEPA),
Jane Wright (RAFTS), Craig Campbell (NFU(S)), John
Armstrong (FRS), Ross Gardiner deputised for John
Armstrong.
Minutes of Previous Meeting
3. The Steering Group approved the minutes of the last
meeting with the following changes:
- The references to 'Rivers and
Fisheries Trusts' should be changed to 'Rivers and
Fisheries Trusts of Scotland'; and
- Ronnie Picken represents only the
Scottish Anglers National Association on the Steering
Group
Action - Secretariat to put approved minutes on
the SE website.
Matters Arising
Task Matrix
4. The Chairman said that the Task Matrix would be a
helpful tool in thinking about what the Steering Group
would report back to the Forum. It was noted that the
under the comment section for annual/ weekly close times
that the sentence 'Grayling - no opposition to the
suggestion made by the GS' should be removed, as it was
agreed at the last Steering Group meeting that enabling
powers should be used to make all close times.
Action - Secretariat to amend the Task Matrix
and put on the website.
Highlands and Islands Aquaculture Forum
5. The Chairman apologised that there was no update from
HIAF due to Gordon Brown's absence.
Action - Chairman to continue to report back on
the work of HIAF
Presentations
6. The Chairman said that he hoped that the
presentations to the Forum would be made by members of the
Steering Group. SEERAD was very keen that policy
developments were an open and inclusive exercise. The
Forum would be chaired by the Scottish Executive, but there
would need to be a lot of Steering Group involvement.
7. The Chairman reminded the meeting that it would be
views of the Steering Group and not personal views that
would be reported back to the Forum. The Institute of
Fisheries Management said that one of the views of the
Steering Group was that the Scottish Executive should be
providing funding, and asked if this could be reported back
to the Forum. The Chairman agreed.
8. The following members of the Steering Group agreed to
give presentations at the FFF:
- Andrew Wallace - Management;
- Willie Miller - Access;
- Peter Maitland -Regulation of fish movements and
the use of live fish as bait;
- Ron Woods - Use of gaffs, tailers, knotted nets and
pike gags; annual/ weekly close times and the use of
multiple rods and rod rests; and
- Alastair Stephen - Rapporteur
9. It was agreed that where there was not total
consensus, then the options that were available would be
presented.
3.1 Management (SFFF SG 6-1)
10. The Association of Salmon Fishery Boards apologised
for not having SFFF SG 6-1 tabled for this meeting, and
reported that the Management Sub-group was still working
on it.
11. The conclusion of the meeting was that in light of
the developments regarding the issue of funding, that there
was not a likely prospect for any radical management
change.
12. Unitary Structures
It was agreed that the Unitary Structure approach was
likely to be a long way off and further discussion would be
needed to decide what they would look like. Another issue
that required discussion within the Steering Group was that
of how to prepare for any further legislation.
13. Existing Legislation
The Management Sub-group had also discussed what could
be done in terms of Management under the capabilities of
the existing legislation. It was reported that progress
had been made with the resources available at the moment,
including the District Salmon Fishery Boards (DSFBs) and
the Fisheries Trust network at addressing certain issues.
It was reported that evolution in terms of management had
occurred in the past due to internal networks. The
existing structures could be developed with the direction
of the Steering Group. It was acknowledged that there may
be sensitivities with this approach, and thought should be
given on how to clear it with the Board and Trusts
networks.
14. It was reported that the evolutionary process was
one which would be a worth while opportunity and it would
not be affected by the new legislative slot. The
presentation that would be made to the forum would include
the options on Management that the Group had come up with,
the issues on funding and the opportunities available.
15. It was agreed that work on what the Unitary
Structure would look like should not be abandoned and
should be developed along with a cost outlay and presented
to the Minister. The Steering Group agreed that there was
a requirement for an independent review on how much a
Unitary Structure would cost.
16. The Scottish Federation for Coarse Angling added
that the Stimulated Evolution approach sounded like the
approach described by the Management Sub-group, and said
that they were more and more convinced that this was the
route in which the Steering Group should go, not only
because of the funding aspect but also because of the
people who would be involved. If the Stimulated Evolution
approach to Management was adopted, then the legislation
could include enabling powers instead of being too
restrictive. Access legislation that encourages the
creation of some sort of local decision making should be
encouraged.
Rod Licences
18. There were some differing views from the Steering
Group on the issue of rod licensing. It was commented that
if the revenue raised from rod licensing went straight back
into fisheries management then more people would buy them.
It was also commented that it would cost too much to
administer a rod licensing system. It was also suggested
that before a decision was taken on whether to introduce
rod licensing in Scotland, more thought needed to be given
to how that system would work. It was reported that the
Management Sub-group had also looked at the system of rod
licences and suggested that the Scottish Executive hire
consultants to investigate further. It was also suggested
that rod licensing did not have to be on a national basis,
it could also be issued regionally and managed locally. It
was also suggested that if any system was introduced that
it needed to be flexible.
19. The Association of Salmon Fishery Boards suggested
that the Steering Group should indicate to the Freshwater
Fisheries Forum that there are both short to medium term
options and also options for the long term, and it should
also be explained that the Steering Group had to re-think
the Management Options just before Christmas when the
funding issue came to light.
Action - ASFB to circulate the paper on options
for management after today's meeting
3.2 Access (SFFF SG 6-2a, SFFF SG 6-2b, SFFF SG
6-2c and SFFF SG 6-2b)
20. The Chairman spoke about the papers tabled for this
issue and asked how the Steering Group would present the
ideas to the Forum. Thought needed to be given to what
message the Steering Group wanted to send to the Forum.
The Chairman reminded the Group of the Minister's
commitment to repeal the 1976 Act. The Institute of
Fisheries Management stated that unless the 1976 Act is
replaced with something better and properly funded and
managed, then why replace it. The Consultative Committee
on Protection Orders thought that there was a possibility
of making progress on replacing the 1976 Act with something
that builds on the existing Protection Order idea but
removes 'blanket protection'. He proposed introducing a
protection order system all over Scotland and applying an
option whereby people can opt out. It was suggested that
there was a need for a Committee to cover the whole of
Scotland, similar to the Consultative Committee on
Protection Orders. SCAPA's view on access was that the
1976 Act should be repealed and replaced with an 'Anglers
Trust'. He explained that the 'Anglers Trust' would lease
the waters in return for protection and this would exclude
stillwater commercial fisheries. The Association of
Scottish Stillwater Fisheries asked how non man made Lochs
obtained legal protection.
21. The SFCA detected a great deal in common with the
suggestion put forward by the Consultative Committee on
Protection Orders and SCAPA. The basic principle from both
suggestions was that if Fisheries were well managed then
they would receive protection. It was noted that there was
general agreement in the fundamentals for access; there
were just some differences in opinion on the fringe
mechanisms.
22. The ASFB thought that the 'Blanket Protection'
approach was too heavy handed and suggested that it was
better to have a more organic process which grows. The
ASSF asked how in a legal sense someone could opt out of a
blanket protection system. If this was possible, then the
'Blanket Protection' system would be perfect. The Steering
Group were in agreement that the 1976 Act should be
repealed.
23. The Steering Group agreed that the three options on
access that would be brought to the Freshwater Fisheries
Forum are as follows:
- Anglers Trust;
- All Scotland Son of Protection
Orders approach; and
- Organic (improved Protection
Order fit for purpose legislation).
The Forum would be informed that the above options were
all still work in progress.
24. It was agreed that the above three options should be
brought to the Forum, and then the feedback from the forum
should be used to report back to the Minister. The
Chairman stated that whatever system covers access it would
need to balance the following three things:
- Promotion of angling;
- Protection of anglers rights;
and
- Protects the fish.
25. It was also agreed that the presentation for the
forum would include a section that covered the weaknesses
of the 1976 Act. Willie Miller agreed to give the
presentation on Access at the Forum.
Action - SEERAD to check with solicitors on the
blanket protection opting out issue
3.3 Miscellaneous
26. Presenters on each issue were agreed as follows:
- The use of gaffs, tailers,
knotted nets and pike gags - Ron Woods
- Regulation of fish movements -
Prof Peter Maitland
- The use of live fish as bait -
Prof Peter Maitland
- Annual/weekly close times - Ron
Woods
- Use of multiple rods and rod
rests - Ron Woods
27. Pike gags
The paper SFFF SG 6-8 was tabled by SFCA. It was agreed
that these should be banned and it was thought that it was
not something that would have a huge impact.
28. Multiple rods
It was agreed that the presentation on multiple rods
would take the note on the task matrix as a starting
point.
29. Fish Movements
The Chairman stated that the regulation of fish
movements is linked to management and access, Gs
contingency plans, and the transfer of water between
catchments. This issue is not just about fish, it also has
ecological and genetic implications. The aim is not to
stop fish movements, just to regulate them.
30. The British Trout Association commented that the
issue of transportation was missing from the paper on the
regulation of fish movements. The biggest disease risk is
people bringing in fish from out with the UK.
31. IFM said that all the Steering Group were doing on
these issues for the Forum was highlighting what can be
done. At this stage it is not known who will administer
this or how it would be carried out and this should be
included in presentations to the Forum.
32. Close Seasons
FRS asked how good the case was for a rigidly proposed
close time for grayling as opposed to enabling powers. The
Chairman stated that as agreed at the last meeting, the
preferred approach would be to use an enabling power .
4. Draft Agenda for the Forum (SFFF SG 6-6)
33. A copy of the draft agenda for the forum was
circulated to the Steering Group. The only change that was
suggested was to change the references to 'submit voting
forms' to 'feedback sessions' and subject to this change,
the agenda could now be circulated to the wider forum.
Action - Secretariat to send out copies of the
agenda to the attendees of the Forum
5. Voting System for the Forum (SFFF SG 6-7)
34. Secretariat had circulated a paper on electronic
'audience response systems' as a suggestion to provide
feedback from the audience of the forum on the issues
presented on the day. There were some reservations about
using this as at this forum; there was nothing solid to
vote on, and all the Steering Group wanted at this stage
was feedback on the issues presented.
35. SNH suggested using the approach where all forum
attendees would be asked to put their comments on 'post-it'
notes and put them on the flip charts for each of the
presentations. Volunteers would then be needed to help
count the 'post-it' note comments so the Rapporteur could
present the summary of the feedback in the conclusions and
close section of the day.
36. The Chairman asked the Steering Group for a
volunteer to be Rapporteur for the Forum. Alastair Stephen
said that he would be Rapporteur.
Action - SNH to contact Secretariat to provide
more information on how the flip chart method of
feedback works
6. A.O.B
Progress Report to Ministers
37. SCAPA asked whether a progress report would be sent
to the Minister following the Forum. The Chairman reported
that there would be one.
Action - SEERAD to produce a progress report on
the Forum for the Minister
7. Date and place of next meeting
10.00am, 1 March 2005, Strathearn House, Perth